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Thursday, November 05, 2009

So How Dark Was Cheney's 'Dark Side' Really? :Pretty Damn Dark.


Former UK ambassador says CIA sent people to be ‘raped with broken bottles’

By Daniel Tencer
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009 -- 3:31 pm

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craigmurray Former UK ambassador: CIA sent people to be raped with broken bottlesThe CIA relied on intelligence based on torture in prisons in Uzbekistan, a place where widespread torture practices include raping suspects with broken bottles and boiling them alive, says a former British ambassador to the central Asian country.

Craig Murray, the rector of the University of Dundee in Scotland and until 2004 the UK's ambassador to Uzbekistan, said the CIA not only relied on confessions gleaned through extreme torture, it sent terror war suspects to Uzbekistan as part of its extraordinary rendition program.

"I'm talking of people being raped with broken bottles," he said at a lecture late last month that was re-broadcast by the Real News Network. "I'm talking of people having their children tortured in front of them until they sign a confession. I'm talking of people being boiled alive. And the intelligence from these torture sessions was being received by the CIA, and was being passed on."

Human rights groups have long been raising the alarm about the legal system in Uzbekistan. In 2007, Human Rights Watch declared that torture is "endemic" to the country's justice system.

Murray said he only realized after his stint as ambassador that the CIA was sending people to be tortured in Uzbekistan, country he describes as a "totalitarian" state that has never moved on from its communist era, when it was a part of the Soviet Union.

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Suspects in Uzbekistan's gulags "were being told to confess to membership in Al Qaeda. They were told to confess they'd been in training camps in Afghanistan. They were told to confess they had met Osama bin Laden in person. And the CIA intelligence constantly echoed these themes."

"I was absolutely stunned -- it changed my whole world view in an instant -- to be told that London knew [the intelligence] coming from torture, that it was not illegal because our legal advisers had decided that under the United Nations convention against torture, it is not illegal to obtain or use intelligence gained from torture as long as we didn't do the torture ourselves," Murray said.

IT'S THE PIPELINE, STUPID

Murray asserts that the primary motivation for US and British military involvement in central Asia has to do with large natural gas deposits in Turkmenistan and Uzbekistan. As evidence, he points to the plans to build a natural gas pipeline through Afghanistan that would allow Western oil companies to avoid Russia and Iran when transporting natural gas out of the region.

Murray alleged that in the late 1990s the Uzbek ambassador to the US met with then-Texas Governor George W. Bush to discuss a pipeline for the region, and out of that meeting came agreements that would see Texas-based Enron gain the rights to Uzbekistan's natural gas deposits, while oil company Unocal worked on developing the Trans-Afghanistan pipeline.

"The consultant who was organizing this for Unocal was a certain Mr. Karzai, who is now president of Afghanistan," Murray noted.

Murray said part of the motive in hyping up the threat of Islamic terrorism in Uzbekistan through forced confessions was to ensure the country remained on-side in the war on terror, so that the pipeline could be built.

"There are designs of this pipeline, and if you look at the deployment of US forces in Afghanistan, as against other NATO country forces in Afghanistan, you'll see that undoubtedly the US forces are positioned to guard the pipeline route. It's what it's about. It's about money, it's about oil, it's not about democracy."

The Trans-Afghanistan Pipeline is slated to be completed in 2014, with $7.6 billion in funding from the Asian Development Bank.

Murray was dismissed from his position as ambassador in 2004, following his first public allegations that the British government relied on torture in Uzbekistan for intelligence.

The following videos were posted to YouTube by the Real News Network on Oct. 26 and Nov. 4, 2009.

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  • donofcali 23 hours ago
    "I'm talking of people having their children tortured in front of them until they sign a confession. I'm talking of people being boiled alive. And the intelligence from these torture sessions was being received by the CIA, and was being passed on."

    So Obama: You're going to continue covering up for these criminals instead of allowing investigations to take place? That makes you an accomplice to raping children doesn't it?
  • Northwestwoods 16 hours ago
    Think he has any choice whatsoever? Think JFK
  • I see the old grey head of Ray McGovern at the head table, whose interview with Brad Friedman expands on exactly your comment. Rather than rehash that story, take a look at this post on an earlier CIA related article (includes links to the audio and transcript of the McGovern interview).

    That's not to say Obama is not responsible. But it says that WE, we who know these things, are equally responsible, and in our numbers are better able to do the great work of rooting out the cancer than he is.

    Put another way, generals don't win wars without armies. Send a general out with a rifle and no troops, and what do you expect him to do against the armies of crime?

    It's WE who must act, and videos like these are our greatest weapon, because our NUMBERS are our only hope.
  • It is evident there is no Al-Qaeda other than the the Al-Qaeda created by torturing patsies into confessing they are Al-Qaeda and the Al-Qaeda Agent provocateurs that work with the world's alphabet soup agencies to frame people for terror acts that the alphabet soup agencies themselves have masterminded.
  • rxgary 22 hours ago
    theres plenty of al-CIA-duhs, they all work for #41 ghwbush
  • Bush 41 is near the top, and was there in Dallas, too.
  • dennycrane 23 hours ago
    These dirty bastards probably charged them "deposits" on the broken bottles. Seriously, when are the ones that orchestrated this shit going to get their day in court? In the mean time, Clinton and bush are going to stage a "friendly" debate just for the hell of it. Storm the fucking building and hall him to the Hague.
  • Freedom'sToast 20 hours ago
    Amen. While we're at it, it's high time we took care of our own terrorists, the CIA. Never was there an organization more inimical to the interests of freedom and liberty, the core values of our founding documents; our raison d'etre.
    Our CIA is seemingly about as bound by morality and law as Hitler's SS. These people are not protecting us, they endanger our very way of life. They have single-handedly (as an organization) earned us generations of enemies worldwide.

    It has been said that "[t]hey hate us for our freedoms." Horsefeathers! "They" hate us for denying them freedom and self-determination. Yet the brainwashing of America continues unabated.

    The CIA stands in the way of civil society and the rule of law more so than does any criminal gang on the planet. They should be drowned in the oil they seek to steal. Or, more practically, the organization should be disbanded forthwith, and its director tried and hanged. If trickle-down economics is laudable, so certainly should be top-down responsibility.

    There's nothing weak about admitting we're wrong. Let's just back up and try a governed intelligence service, one which is actually accountable to law and humanity; one closely monitored and kept in check by the same laws as apply to citizens.

    Mr. Obama, opportunity for respectability dwindles. A church-going man, perhaps the time for reflection is nigh, as respects "do[ing] unto others".
  • mick57 22 hours ago
    America has become a cancer ,you had power with no ethics .Now prepare to lose that power.
  • marxymcliberalson 20 hours ago
    Some of us do realize this and are trying our best to change her. Say what you will about the USA, we deserve a heaping share of blame on all kinds of counts over our existence, however one thing we did have was a perceived moral authority. No matter what criticisms you levelled at us we were a country who championed human rights and condemned human abuses, well, publicly, in rhetoric, if not technically in practice. But now Bush and Cheney and a radical Right Wing have convinced a large part of our populace that some torture is ok in some cases. This just pulls the entire table out from under the house of cards that used to be our moral authority. Don't take too much satisfaction in our decline, if nothing else we used to represent a goal, an achievement, a symbol of Freedom and Liberty.
  • donofcali 20 hours ago
    "Bush and Cheney and a radical Right Wing have convinced a large part of our populace that some torture is ok in some cases."

    This is why Obama needs to allow the American people to see those torture pictures. Very few republicons believe that their leaders allowed serious torture to happen. These people need to see the pictures of the CIA or contractors raping women, torturing children, and committing all the other sickenning things that they did. The pictures of the atrocities must be put directly in front of their collective faces.
  • Northwestwoods 16 hours ago
    Unfortunately, evangelicals as a group tend to be more accepting of torture than the general population.
  • mick57 17 hours ago
    "Don't take too much satisfaction in our decline" ,I take NO satisfaction in your decline .It sickens me as the "free world" like it or not is modeled on America.I'm Australian and I live in New Zealand (both countries that have looked up to the US).But watch the videos on this link and tell me what you think of the Decline of the USA.

    http://canadiansforpalestine.ning.com/profiles/blogs/former-uk-ambassador-cia-sent
  • If enough of us become aware, it can still be saved. But "enough" is a big number.

    Let's get busy, we who know. All it takes is enough people who know, essentially, the truth of these two YouTube vids. This may be the most compact piece of truth ever put in such a small space. It's all there — UNOCAL, Karzai, rendition, CIA planes, photos of boiled children. I heard this account on Alex Jones three or four years ago, but this video is more effective than that audio was, although the tale is the same.

    If the American public doesn't learn these things, we WE you and I are complicit along with the British Foreign Office. Let's run with this one.
  • ManOfTheNorth 2 hours ago
    If that behaviour is even possible within your definition of "Freedom" and "Liberty", I'd prefer a benevolent dictatorship to it.

    What is needed here is a set of morals that rise above issues of governance. It isn't happening, folks, and unless it does - these days there is so much raw power available to the human race that the likely result is our own extinction.

    Worse yet, an evolution into the nasty minds we see at play today in the fields of commerce that dictate the playgrounds of our children - the fields of war.
  • greg789 22 hours ago
    The sad part is it does not even take broken bottles to get a confession. A little rope and a few hours in a "stress position" will do it. One of our Vietnam era pilots said that within minutes he was in such pain that he would have tossed his son into a furnace to make it stop. We admitted to using the "stress positions" on these people as if it were minor inconvenience.
  • In addition, stress positions have a powerful psychological advantage, in that you are torturing yourself. This is scientific mind control, the bitter fruit of our poisonous psychiatry profession, including what it gleaned from the Nazis in PROJECT PAPERCLIP.
  • buckqjohnson 23 hours ago
    Bingo!!!! I've known for a few years now about the Uzbecks using torture (even on their own people) to get confessions real or not. Even to use it just to keep people in line. You have to remember before 9/11 Afghanistan taliban ambassador came to the US to discuss having a pipeline through the country for the same reason. Then 9/11 happened.
  • kayttt2000 18 hours ago
    Me to,

    I know how they did UBecksstand,,.Becks Stand(slang for market),,and the broken bottles,,
    I'm still working on the" boiling them alive"..

    There was a sign we had in our Stand,,
    "Custard's last Stand"
  • If I didn't know your own story, kayttt, I'd take offense at your lightness. But you're excused, seeing what you've been through at their hands.
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Reactions

  • RT @SocialistViews: CIA's rendition program had people raped with broken bottles, boiled alive http://bit.ly/4lNPRK #afghanistan
  • RedReverend22 hours ago
    RT @SocialistViews CIA's rendition program had people raped with broken bottles, boiled alive http://bit.ly/4lNPRK #gop #p2 #obama #justice
  • PDXracer22 hours ago
    Its not torture, its only super enhanced interrogation!
  • DianeSweet22 hours ago
    RT @RawStory Ambassador: CIA sent people to be ‘raped with broken bottles’ Raw Story http://bit.ly/3h2Nwx
    One more retweet from kevingosztola
  • SocialistViews22 hours ago
    CIA's rendition program had people raped with broken bottles, boiled alive http://bit.ly/4lNPRK #afghanistan #p2 #obama
  • buckbova22 hours ago
    They made them move to Detroit?
  • softlabhennef23 hours ago
    Former UK ambassador Craig Murray: CIA sent people to be ‘raped with broken bottles’ http://bit.ly/4xLmnW
  • kidnapandframe23 hours ago
    9.11 - rethink it.
  • kirchoff23 hours ago
    *And I'm proud to be an American, Where I can make pretend I'm Free! Sam can keep on boiling people alive So long as I get my health care for free!*






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